Killers and Thieves

Não é meu estilo, jogando não fluiu nada. Só deixando o meu "Passei por aqui"

I finally finished this game today. It's a great little gem, nice little twist in the end. It requires a certain maturity with regards to realizing the strategies that you can or should do. When I got this game, I HATED IT. It was difficult and everyone kept ending up in prison. Fast forward a couple of years later, I decided to try it again. I started a new game and stuck with it over the course of the week. It doesn't really matter what skills your thieves have. What matters is what your current group of four (at most) have and how you make it work.

A good game, but underbaked - needs more variety, better pathfinding & some polishing. It's a timer-based side-scrolling thieving strategy (alike 'action phase' in 'This War of Mine' with random level generation a bit resembling 'King Ludwig' tabletop game), also with thieves roster and a bit of trading, which sounds super cool to me, but overall clunkiness (UI lacks flow) and the 'samey' feel of it seriously undermine the potential here.

Watch out, there are multiple gamebreaking bugs! Don't buy this unfinished and abandoned game.

This game is very repetitive, to get something new is very long. it will bore you quickly before you get to the point. it didn't take long for you to master the game. I don't really recommend it if you want action and jumping things. The abilities given are very limited so it's very easy to get the combination that suits you. There is no explanation about the abilities in detail, you have to understand them self-taught.

Killers and Thieves is a bad game, its not so much that its broken (although there are bugs) or even poorly designed, so much as it is lacking, for a finished game so much is missing that it makes it impossible to recommend this game. So lets talk about whats here and so you get an idea of whats missing. The game is divided into two parts managing the thieves guild and heists. Lets start with guild management as theres not much here despite it being one of the two major elements of the game. You'll hire and train thieves to work for the guild, they in turn will steal things and you'll fence them for the gold to pay the bills. And what are those bills? well you pay a weekly fee to your thieves and fences and thats it. The guild is so lacking I was convinced I'd missed something but thats all there is and as a result your gold will build up leaving the main feature of heists (stealing gold) feeling pointless. Then add on top of that the fact that fencing goods is a pain, you'll have certain shops that will sell your goods, but they have types of goods they will sell (general goods, clothes, liquor) if you sell the wrong goods it takes longer to sell and fetch lower prices, on top some districts have bonuses and penalties to certain types of goods. Stores also have limited space for fenced items so you can only sell maybe 4 at a time, so having the right type of stores is important if only to sell things quickly and clear the backlog on stolen goods. But theres the problem that most stores are random for each player (there are some fixed stores everyone will get) so you could be missing a store type until you advance the story to get that fixed store or the only art store in your game might be in a district with a penalty to art, I never found a weapons or jewelry store for example (all stores are hidden and you have to find them). But thats not even the worst of it, when you sell goods you don't go to a sales screen and select a store to sell goods oh no, you go to the world map then to the district map, then to the store menu then sell items to that ONE store then back out to the world map to the next district map to the next store menu EVERY SINGLE TIME. And with that limited inventory space you'll have to do this multiple times for every store just to offload the gear from a single large heist. So then maybe the second half of the game will make up for it? Not really, you'll start off your heists on the district maps, these start off blank and you'll deploy thieves on stakeouts to find anything of value, this will reveal any stores as well as the general value of items in the areas you can heist. This by the way is the only real non heist option for your thieves but it doesn't even show you the radius of the stakeouts effect, so its easy for you to miss things (stores and taverns) hidden on the map without realizing it. There are also guard icons on the map and they add extra guards to any area with that icons radius, but again you can't tell what that radius is, so deciding to rob this building is hard because are those guards in range or not? no way to tell. And now into the heist itself, you'll load in on the street with a range of buildings, each building has one entrance and is made up of random collection of rooms, this is true of all districts with just the size of the buildings being different. You'll have to go into the building a steal their loot and there are locks, guards and civilians to get in the way. And thats it, thats all there is, after a single mission you've seen all the game has to throw at you and all thats left is to throw more of it at you as the game progresses. So how about the tools you have to get around these challenges. well theres stealth, you have a number based on the thieves stats, this is a counter and when you are seen by someone it goes down, once it hits zero everyone in the district will know what you're up to and attack you on sight, you can hide but that just makes the counter go down slower and given the random guard patrols, you can end up with a guards just standing there watch you for 10 minutes and once that counters gone you lose the ability to hide and it never recovers. Given that guards will just hang out in narrow passages and watch you how can you get around them? well theres not alot you can do, its here that the big holes show the most theres so much you'd expect from a stealth games toolbox that just isn't here, you can't throw rocks or distract guard, you can't stealth past them, you can't lure them out, you CAN fight them but this lowers your stealth to zero instantly and fights are random dice rolls, you don't know how well your guys gonna do, and they can't escape from a fight, they either win, die or go to jail thats it. Thats a problem as when the games advanced to the point where you're watching six guards move about the single entrance that buildings have, especially when none of your limited skills help (climb lets you climb the outsides of buildings but you have to be inside the house to start with, acrobatics can let you leap from building to building again from inside and only for building close enough together, something you won't know until you're in the level). I could go on, I haven't even touched on the bugs, but if the above screed isn't enough warning for you, nothing will be.

I only paid $1.99 for the game, but that was too much. Game is extremely buggy, which sucks because it's a concept that I like. Half way through I can't progress anymore as one mission doesn't register me completing the goal properly

A lovely-looking, well-planned game that nevertheless plays like one of its heists: you get your foot in the door, and then everything turns into a disaster. It's hard to articulate what the problem is, but I think part of it is that this is a *very* information-dependent game, and that information is cumbersome to get to. For example, Morale. Morale affects performance in an abstract but important way, but it's not shown on the popout roster displaying your thieves. So you have to open up your full roster, page through your thieves, check each one's morale, and then decide whether to assign them to carousing. You also have to do this to check when you should de-assign them from carousing, and check when they've taken a morale hit, because the game won't tell you. Going to the full roster screen requires a short load, and then another load to return from it. I *like* the morale system and carousing as a recovery mechanism and all the other things the game is trying to do, but this feels bad, and in a game that's very turn-management-based, playing well means at minimum you should have a notepad out in front of you as you jot down plans for who to assign where next. The heists themselves are not hugely better. They're basically multiple-character This War Of Mine, a game that fundamentally worked because it was single-character. You have to be squatting on a context point in order for it to pop up, and this makes figuring out where you need to go to find out what you need to loot an exercise in frustration. I really want to play more of this, as the game-as-intended is great, but the game-as-presented is not, and just trying to wrangle the interface is frustrating.

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Very good idea, but not well polished in the end. Game have big room for a good storyline and vivid characters, and yet all I do is skipping the dialogs. The girl, main character is too cute to be bloody murder, and it's very stupid that she can carry loot two times bigger than her fellow thief who is a very big man. Another bad side is that all the thieves looks the same. I know it's becouse of low budget, but they should at least have different colours of rugs...I'm very disappointed, especially after playing fabulous Banner Saga from the same team.